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Red5
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 8:31:26 PM

I am very dissapointed in the performance of someone's opping. I will not say who, but if this discussion goes anywhere, I will reveal his name. My good man Swomz and I have been banned numerous times with no explanation whatsoever. We query him, yet he does not answer. He will tell you he was not there, but he is. We query him immediately after we are banned to inquire why. Yet we get no answer. I am not familiar with military procedures, but is this not disrespect? He expects our respect, yet he gives us none. Why, I happen to have some logs to prove my point: Nope Red5> but you're talking to me. *> i was eating dinner Red5> So why do you ban us? *> cause you were being a prick Red5> thats not really a reason *> yea it is Now people, is that really a reason? This man simply cannot take a joke my friends, and I think, because the VE is supposed to be fun, and fun is, I quote from this man, "What we make it", he should not have this much power. Here was my joke of the day: MegaDeth> swomz, y are u so annoying? Red5> why are you? MegaDeth> go play on I-25 or something MegaDeth> Red5, go get your squadron active Swomz> um Swomz> no Swomz> and I was just answering for myself when I said no K3R> my bologna has a first name K3R> it's h o m e r Swomz> so shut up urself goddamnit MegaDeth> O-S-C-A-R MegaDeth> thats a kick swanny boy Red5> Ain't my squadron K3R> how about you both take this someplace else so i don't have to see it Red5> We all know where you take it

Red5> just kidding K And voila, I am banned. Oops, guess I let his name slip. Well, we all have some dislike for this man. He has a real job you know, and thats why it takes months for Chapter Eight to get started. *** MegaDeth is now known as Riel_Fury Say66> lo, Riel Red5> And what would that be, LS? K3R> look at how much i care about what you think Red * arturus salutes *** K3R is now known as K3R-Gone Red5> Thank God. Red5> I can't stand that hole. yet again I am banned. Did you know that he uses profanity in the channels? I thought that was against CoC's. And if he is "gone", its not disrespecting him. Aren't we allowed to voice our opinions here? VE isn't communism. Yet. Here's another little snippet: Red5|Deciphering> So when does chapter eight start? *** K3R sets mode: -o Somewhere K3R> when i spell check the first bit Red5|Deciphering> umm, that should take about five minutes. K3R> first off K3R> i'm at work K3R> 2nd off K3R> i don't know if you know this K3R> but ther'es a big fking fire outside my city Red5|Deciphering> How the h3ll should I know where you live? K3R> i've been spending sometime volunteering taking care of firefighters K3R> so why don't you shut up Red5|Deciphering> why don't you? K3R> all you guys do is b*tch Oh, look at the language here. Isn't that terrible? But he used the real letters. I was exposed to this. Again, this man can take neither a joke nor sarcasm. There are many other things this man has said to me; I thought he was a responsible adult before, and I actually respected him. I had no qualms. But now he has shattered my respect, and many others with me. I have been banned from the VE channel for saying I did not like him, though he said he did not like me numerous times (if you want the log, I've got it!). So for all of you who think this might just be an abuse of power, please post some little thoughts here on why K3R is not a very good opp, or why he needs a vacation, or a massage, or something. Oh, and I'm supposed to put this at the end: K3R>just write at the bottom K3R> i'm leaving cause i'm not having fun Take it however you want it. ----------------------- i>Winners never quit; quitters never win./i> [PO1][Red5]/[Nazgul]-[1]/[Wing 1]/[None]/[1VENF]/VEN [=A=] (medals)

[This message has been edited by (edited June 20, 2002 8:36:01 PM)]

Threeof4
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 8:34:52 PM

Ladies and gentlemen you've seen the evidence, it's now up to you to decide. Let's put it to a vote, if you really want me gone, I'll leave. Three

-----------------------
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Liquid
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 8:42:45 PM

Three, i vote against it, I take that back, if you leave, i'm gonna stay, for a while, and see if it gets any better. if it doesn't, i'm out. ----------------------- ADJ:NTO EFM/PO1 Liquid/Aegis 1-3 (Aegis Three)/Wing1/mSSD Atrus/DEF/VEN/VE/(=A=)(=SA=) TRN/UNI Liquid/Sith/TBA/TBA/VEDJ Mountain Dew and doughnuts...because breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

[This message has been edited by Liquid (edited June 20, 2002 8:44:11 PM)]

Argon Viper
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 8:55:45 PM

I've noticed this as well(having played my share of immature pranks on him...), but I've never once been banned... I won't vote for Three to leave(even though we disagree on pretty much everything), but I do suggest that he lighten up(the reason we disagree so much). The comments I've seen here are normal from 3, and I've come to expect them(I don't even really notice his profanity anymore...), but I can see where it can get on your nerves. I'm just gonna suggest the same thing I've been suggesting ever since Kip and I first disagreed(see if he listens this time), lighten up, take a joke, and don't go out of your way to talk to people you dislike. Enjoy

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Argon Viper
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Cosmic
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:00:03 PM

I vote for Three to stay in the VE. He may seem a little irritated at times, but in my opinion, he's a hard worker. That's what the VE needs right now. Now, the reason for being kicked or banned, Red5, isn't because Three can't take a joke. He can. It's how you talk with your joke-like manner and your sarcasm. It's not his fault that he bans or kicks people for something they deserved. For all of you who still don't understand, I suggest you take a closer look at different people and their nature. Many people aren't always the "polite and perfect-manner" kind of people. There aren't a lot of "polite and perfect-manner" people in the Vast Empre, either. So, my advice to you is to either learn to deal with people or get out. You'll learn sooner or later in life that you cannot avoid people who are differen't from the "polite and mannered" way. Now, as to voicing your opinion. That's perfectly fine. However, many things are to be kept to yourself or in PM. Anything that insults another person or stating that someone is a "hole" in the main channel is not the way to go. Even if someone has or doesn't have the |Gone beside their name, it's just not done. It shouldn't be done. Well, that's my say in this. ----------------------- Dawk "Cosmic" Rhonaey CoT/MAJ Cosmic/HCA-3/VEA/VE [OPE][OTH][OPA][IH][CDS][EW1][GS][SoS][MSM][IOC] ----------------------- Dawk "Cosmic" Rhonaey SL/DJK Cosmic/Lion 1-1/mSSD Atrus/VEDJ/VE [VP][KC1][OAK] -----------------------

[This message has been edited by Cosmic (edited June 20, 2002 9:07:06 PM)]

Argon Viper
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:20:08 PM

Cos, no disrespect intended, but you haven't been on the receiving end of 3 have you? Speaking for myself(and probably every other FA or DK member), I'm on that end every day. I admit that I'm immature, I admit that I can be annoying at times, but not nearly enough to deserve what Kip is always pushing at either me personally or the FA or the DK in general. My opinion in this club is generally that people should be allowed to have fun, and so I do. That seems to get on Kip's nerves, so I avoid him. I won't say that this is comfortable for either of us, and the times when we do come in contact usually aren't pretty. In fact, the only time we've even remotely agreed on any issue in the past few months is with the setup of our squads relating to the new specialties. I don't suppose you can say you have that kind of record regarding Kip? If not, you probably don't see the problem that we deal with every day from him.

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Argon Viper
IW COL Argon Viper{ret}
"History is on the move, those who cannot keep up will watch from a distance, and those who get in our way will not watch at all" - Grand Admiral Thrawn
"How boring life would be if everyone felt the same way we do..." - Argon Viper
"Condemnation does not liberate, it oppresses" - Carl G Jung

Tycho Celchu
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:34:19 PM

Well, I dunno...I don't want to comment on this because I was not there for any of these events. What I will say is that a couple of the ops do swear on the channel occasionally, which is against the CoC. In some cases, they make up for it by being a tad bit more lenient for a little while, but it is a bit frustrating to get kicked for bad language, only to see the op who does it use the same language.

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Corporal Tycho Celchu, Slicer
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Talon
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:40:18 PM

It disgusts me to see you voting to see if you want your Operations Officer to stay in the VE or not. We don't get paid to do this you know.. And you're right, the VE isn't communistic.. but it's not democratic either, so get the thought of "my rights" out of your head. You have no rights.

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PRF-RC/BG Sierra "Talon" Taurus/HCA-1/VEA/VE[BC][IOC][LoC][SoS][BM][CDS][MSM]
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Otto Vox
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:41:40 PM

I vote no against Kip leaving thee VE. Argon, Cos may not have been on the recieving end of Kip, but I have, and I'm still voting for him to stay. Concerning the whole line of Red calling Kip a hole, even with him not there, that's still disrespecting him. Red, you just said it at the wrong time, plus, you gotta know Kip, he's not always not there. Some times he just doesn't want people talking to him. This has been edited to also accomidated Talons post. I may have voted, but it seemed that the keeping him side needed some support. And you're right, you don't get payed, you have the right to go off on someone for giving your time to this community. ----------------------- Otto Vox Army: Gunnery Sergeant Dark Jedi Order: Krath Adept Platoon 1 Sqaud 3: Raiders (XO) XO/TRP/AD/CE/GSGT Otto Vox/3SQD/1PLT/1COM/1BAT/1RGT/VEA/VEDJ/VEEC/VE(LM)(ES) TRN/AD Otto Vox/Trainee 7/Training Sect/VEDJ "War is full of evil and hate, I'm just here to end it. Then do the paper work."

[This message has been edited by Otto Vox (edited June 20, 2002 9:44:10 PM)]

Riel Fury
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:48:01 PM

First off... Red5, you've been in a lot of trouble before in the #VE for many things you have said. Therefore, you're on much thinner ice than most others. Same as Swomz. Also, in the log, I noticed a lot of it was omitted that would have been degragating you and Swomz. Mighty curious indeed... On the point of Kiparoos leaving... if he leaves, I leave, and it's that damn simple. If you immature little punks can't show some common sense and not annoy someone who hardly talks in the channel in the first place, then I don't want to be in the club. Here's your chance, Swomz, kill your two greatest enemies with one stone. So, when you think of the "vote" for Three, think of it as a vote for Riel as well.

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Argon Viper
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 9:51:56 PM

Otto, I never voted against him, in fact, I specifically voted for him. My only complaint is the PO'd attitude he takes when anyone he remotely dislikes is nearby. I'm one of them, and it's very hard for me to do the things I need to when he's around. All I've said is that he should lighten up

Otto Vox
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 10:00:56 PM

Aaa, well then, that changes my whole point. Kip does need to lighten up, espeically on the smaller brained foke, it's not they're fault they're stupid.

Just uh, punch something.

-----------------------
Otto Vox
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"War is full of evil and hate, I'm just here to end it. Then do the paper work."

Tycho Celchu
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 10:10:38 PM

I agree with Argon...Threeof4 does get a PO'd attitude sometimes...thankfully I don't think I cause it anymore (I hate doing that). The vote shouldn't have even come to pass...its stupid.

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Corporal Tycho Celchu, Slicer
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Gui Sun Paan
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 10:12:25 PM

While I often moan and complain about how Three acts sometimes, and in the past have wanted him out, even recently I admit, I am forced to vote no. Despite what I may think of his character, Three of 4 is one of the VE's best officers(And I mean that, I'm not just saying that). I also sympathize with him and the fact that he must be dealing with a lot of frightening things right now. Three, if you need to vent about any of this, I'm more than happy to listen. The rest of you, give the guy a break. His very home is being threatened now because of some idiot ranger. Those of you who are disrespecting him are only making it worse for him.

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Lord Darth Gui Sun "Sandrock" Paan de Vortigern
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Cosmic
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 10:57:04 PM

I have to admit, I don't remember the last time (if there ever has been a time) when I was at the end of one of Three of 4's "discussions". However, I've been in the Vast Empire for almost two years now, and I've seen Three of 4. His responses are totally normal, so I don't get all upset about it. Now, on a second note, I agree with Talon on this. This "vote" is absolutely stupid. The Vast Empire is a Star Wars club with certain rules. Rules which help us to have fun. Sure, we have voting to see who gets what for awards and such, but that was the original plan when this club was made (from what I can tell). This is no democracy. This is a Star Wars club. ----------------------- Dawk "Cosmic" Rhonaey CoT/MAJ Cosmic/HCA-3/VEA/VE [OPE][OTH][OPA][IH][CDS][EW1][GS][SoS][MSM][IOC] ----------------------- Dawk "Cosmic" Rhonaey SL/DJK Cosmic/Lion 1-1/mSSD Atrus/VEDJ/VE [VP][KC1][OAK] -----------------------

[This message has been edited by Cosmic (edited June 20, 2002 10:57:52 PM)]

Darkhawk
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 11:15:19 PM

If you all don't stop voting I'm going to leave! Sheesh. Again, I have chosen my side, but that thought will remain unvoiced, as it should. Three can decide for himself whether or not to stay or to go, as can Red5 and Swomz - without putting it up to some kind of twisted vote. I agree with Tycho's first post. I was not part of any of these conversations, nor did I even witness them. However, the majority of the Ops do not follow CoC all of the time in the main channel; anyone could tell you that. So what to do? I feel that if someone is to be an Op then they should do their job - just like with any position in the VE. However, I'm not sure that everyone feels that way. Oh well. I've already said more than I wanted to.

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Argon Viper
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 20, 2002 11:26:15 PM

Okay, I'm gonna be dealing with this in a different way, Cya

Majere
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 21, 2002 12:15:06 AM

I may be retired, but I am still a Co-Founder for this club so I hope I have a little say in things. Red5 you are grossly out of line for your post. Whether you are right or wrong doesn't explain the fact that you are bashing a fellow member of the Vast Empire. If you have a problem with Threeof4 you should go to his boss (GM Kadann) via e-mail. The Vast Empire has never been a democracy. Its a dictatorship. If you don't like how GM Kadann and his High Council runs things you should leave. This vote should have never taken place and this message should be locked... "Praise in public; punish in private." ----------------------- --SIGNED-- Adalric Majere, DJM Head of the High Council (ret)

[This message has been edited by Majere (edited June 21, 2002 12:20:18 AM)]

Talon
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 21, 2002 12:25:32 AM

Holy... Well, I came to this thread expecting the total oposite.. even though I should have come to expect that from Maj by now. Ok.. This is one of the few times I agree with Majere. Well spoken, former bossman.

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Kadann
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RE: An abuse of IRC power--Yes, K, thats you.

June 21, 2002 12:37:49 AM

As a result of this topic, all CoC's, rules, and regulations will be enforced to their full effect. I have been really lax in the past and was hoping to not have to do this, but apparently some people can not conduct themselves in a decent manner.

Chapter 1: Insolence - Any member or officer who mocks or disrespects a superior officer, either privately or in the presence of others, shall be guilty of insolence, a Class I Offense.
Chapter 2: Insubordination - Any member or officer who continually or maliciously disrespects a superior officer, either privately or in the presence of others, shall be guilty of insubordination, a Class II Offense.
Chapter 3: Gross Insubordination - Any member or officer who continually or maliciously disrespects a superior officer, either privately or in the presence of others, after having received a direct order (either implicit or explicit) to cease such conduct, shall be guilty of gross insubordination, a Class III offense.
Chapter 4: Disorderly Conduct - Any member or officer who mocks or disrespects any other member or officer of the Vast Empire, either privately or in the presence of others, shall be guilty of disorderly conduct, a Class I Offense.
Chapter 5: Gross Disorderly Conduct - Any member or officer who continually or maliciously mocks or disrespects any other member or officer of the Vast Empire, either privately or in the presence of others, shall be guilty of gross disorderly conduct, a Class II Offense.
Chapter 6: Conduct Unbecoming an officer - Any member or officer who continually or maliciously disrespects any other member or officer or the Vast Empire, either privately or in the presence of others, after having received a direct order (either implicit or explicit) to cease such conduct, shall be guilty of conduct unbecoming an officer, a Class III offense.

Don't think that I am only talking to ops either. From reviewing this post, Threeof4 was right in kicking/banning Red5. By posting this, you broke a few rules yourself.

Chapter 5: Mutiny - Any member or officer who unlawfully usurps the authority of a superior, thereby attempting to displace said superior, shall be guilty of mutiny, a Class III offense.
Chapter 6: Treason - Any member or officer who acts in a manner directly opposed to the interests of the club, thereby knowingly attempting to do damage to the club, either alone or in collusion with others, for personal gain or that of others, and with or without consideration for or from an enemy organization, shall be guilty of Treason, a Class III offense.

I want everyone to look over the VE Axiom and see what the results of breaking these rules are. They will not be enforced for this occurence, but any thereafter will be carried out in full. If anyone has any problems in the future, they will be directed to me via email.

-----------------------
Grand Moff Kadann, Dark Lord
Head of the Vast Empire High Council
Grand Master of the Dark Jedi Order
HHC/GM/GM Kadann/HC-1/DC-1/mSSD Atrus {EE}{MoH}{TT}{SY4}

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