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Topic:  New List
Willtconq
ComNet Sage
 
Willtconq
 
[VE-NAVY] 2nd Lieutenant
 
Post Number:  3701
Total Posts:  4599
Joined:  Oct 2004
Status:  Offline
  New List
November 5, 2009 1:49:32 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
Den's comment on the Re-enlistment gave me this idea. Instead of spending all this time trying to come up with a list of the dead and who might be awesome to rise from the dead and the past, why not spend the time coming up with a list of the future.

So this is what I would like everyone to do. post in here on how you think the Navy, any aspect of it, as a whole, training, squadrons, conduct, story writing, etc, that could be improved upon. Try to be specific, not just something like "we could improve on activity."

Who knows, your idea just might come to pass. *hint hint*

I hope that every single active member will at least post once. REPETITIONS ARE WELCOME. The more people thinks something needs to be changed, the more likely something can be done about it.

Discussion on previously presented ideas are welcome as well. so please don't hold back if you have an opinion about an idea.



To start us off:

VE Meeting Attendance. in the past months, except for last week, there has been close to no naval personnel coming to the VE meetings. In the short time i've been back, two people from the Army has told me that "The Navy is Dead" I don't blame them. Between mid September and mid October, there wasn't even a single Navy report presented during the VE meeting, no representative whatsoever.

I hope that people will take part more on IRC. I know it is not required, but then nothing is required. One more person on IRC, at any time, would mean a more active Navy. Last week, there were 5 people from the Navy present for the VE Meeting, as a result, each one of them received a 25k bonus from me.

I'm on there as much as possible every day, hope to see you all there as well.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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[This message has been edited by Willtconq (edited November 5, 2009 4:34:36 PM)]
Atrasin
ComNet Member
 
Atrasin
 
[VE-NAVY] Ensign
 
Post Number:  648
Total Posts:  1957
Joined:  Jan 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 2:46:53 PM    View the profile of Atrasin 
I've bumped my FOCE.
It's an idea well past it's time, take a look.
SC|ESN Geordi "Driver" Atrasin/Nazgul 1-1/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN/VE/[=A=][=^SA^=][=^ME^=][=*MA*=][=FOCE=][MC1]{BWC}[NSR:1]{SAS}{SWC}
Vacuus Ordo, Nex  -Without Order, Death
All a man can betray is his conscience. - Joseph Conrad
We few, we happy few. We band of brothers. - Henry V
May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - General George S. Patton Jr.
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Arturo
ComNet Novice
Imperial Baronet

 
Arturo
 
[VE-NAVY] Senior Crewman
 
Post Number:  35
Total Posts:  277
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 3:00:16 PM    View the profile of Arturo 
More Esprit de Corps.

I've been here only a short while, so correct me if I'm wrong, but there seems to me to be no real identification among Navy members with their units, and the Navy as a whole.  We're all just "members" or "pilots", not "Viper Members" or "Nazgul Pilots".

Improving this could possibly involve more inter- (and intra-) squadron competitions, whether its writing, gaming, rp-ing, whatever.  Also, in writing stories, why not just have a story or two (other than "vacation" stories) that involves a squadron's (or wing's, etc.) members simply interacting with one another, or "bonding" if you wish. 

I could be way off in left field here, but this has been my impression of the Navy thusfar- more like a bureaucracy than unit.
SCRW Arturo Lee
Nazgul Squadron Flight 3 Member
Imperial Baronet
FM/SCRW Arturo Lee/Nazgul 3-11/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1FLT/VEN/VE/(=*A*=)
Atrasin
ComNet Member
 
Atrasin
 
[VE-NAVY] Ensign
 
Post Number:  649
Total Posts:  1957
Joined:  Jan 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 3:00:21 PM    View the profile of Atrasin 
i also created a new officers rank list, creating a few more ranks so we can give more opportunities for promotion, also seperating enlisted and officer ranks more.  as a bonus we sound more nautical....


OFFICERS    CURRENT RANK
RANK                   ABBREV.    PAY RATE    EQUIVILANCE
Grand Admiral    GADM    800000   
Sector Admiral    SADM    600000   
High Admiral    HADM    450000   
Fleet Admiral    FADM    300000   
Admiral                   ADM    200000   
Vice Admiral    VADM    100000   
Rear Admiral    RADM    90000   
Commodore    CDRE    80000   
Fleet Captain    FCAP    70000    LCAP
Line Captain    LCAP    60000    CAPT
Captain                   CAPT    50000    CDR /LCDR
Commander    CDR     40000    LT2/LT1
Lieutenant Cmdr        LCDR    30000    CWO/ENS
Lieutenant                   LT    25000    WO1/WO2
Flight Lieutenant    FTLT    20000    MCPO
Lieutenant (Junior Grade)
                                LT(JG)    18000    CPO/SCPO
Ensign                  ENS    15000    PO1/PO2
Midshipman    MID    13000    LCRW/SCRW
Officer Candidate    OC    11000    CRW
           
ENLISTED    
RANK    ABBREV    PAY RATE   
Master Chief Petty Officer of the Empire
                                   MCPOE    25000    LT2/LT1
Fleet Master Chief Petty Officer
                                   FMCPO    21000    ENS
Command Master Chief Petty Officer
                                           CMCPO    19000    CWO
Master Chief Petty Officer     MCPO     17000    WO1
Senior Chief Petty Officer    SCPO    15000    WO2
Chief Petty Officer, 1st Class    CPO1    11000    MCPO
Chief Petty Officer, 2nd Class    CPO2    9000    SCPO
Petty Officer                   PO    7000    CPO
Boatswain                                   BOS    5000    PO1
Boatswain's Mate                   BM    4000    PO2
Specialist                                   SPEC    3000    SCRW
Specialist's Mate                   SPECM    2000    LCRW
Crewman                                   CRW    1000    CRW
SC|ESN Geordi "Driver" Atrasin/Nazgul 1-1/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN/VE/[=A=][=^SA^=][=^ME^=][=*MA*=][=FOCE=][MC1]{BWC}[NSR:1]{SAS}{SWC}
Vacuus Ordo, Nex  -Without Order, Death
All a man can betray is his conscience. - Joseph Conrad
We few, we happy few. We band of brothers. - Henry V
May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - General George S. Patton Jr.
Imperial Network Star Wars Image
Willtconq
ComNet Sage
 
Willtconq
 
[VE-NAVY] 2nd Lieutenant
 
Post Number:  3702
Total Posts:  4599
Joined:  Oct 2004
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 4:33:21 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
Arturo, believe me when i say this, squadron pride runs quite high in the VE at times. for most non-officer members, in their entire career in the VE, they only get to serve one unit/squad/squadron. Such as myself before coming back to active duty, the only squadron i served in was Kaph, for over three years.

In fact, sometimes i think there's too much hostility between the squadrons, for example, no one from Viper ever comes into Nazgul's topic, and vice versa, 95% of the time at least.

Competition wise, we have the ESC, but usually we only have it when there's three or more active squadrons, not much to compete against if you're either the winner or the loser.

However, I do agree with your opinion that there should be more bonding between all of the members as a whole, such as a wing story.

______


Atrasin, I'm not sure if this way of organizing the ranks would help us or create more confusion. In real life navy, all pilots are officers, and the enlisted ranks are mostly deck hands, ship crew, and the like. However, in the VEN, all members, even the Crewmen, start off as pilots. There is no subdivision of ship crew. So i'm not sure how much this separation of officers and enlisted would help.

_____


While we're on the topic of ship crews, I just got another idea. In the game Republic Commandos, (assuming everyone has at least heard of the name) aside from the squad of commandos, there's always an unseen 5th member of the squad. This person is called "Adviser" and serves as a spotter sort of person for the squad from the safety of the base ship or command center.

The main purpose of this person is real time contact with the squad/squadron in the field with the higher ups. at the same time able to access secure information through the command center and provide the field units with up-to-minute intel as they come in.

For starters, this could be an NPC, and later on filled in by someone not in the deployed squadron, possibly in the officer ranks in order to access classified intel. This would, I believe, open up a whole new venue for story development, char/squadron development, etc.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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Hunter-Morrell
ComNet Veteran
 
Hunter-Morrell
 
[VE-NAVY] Master Chief Petty Officer
[VE-VEEC] Word Slinger
 
Post Number:  1184
Total Posts:  2071
Joined:  Jun 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 4:39:12 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
Driver: If you want me to, I can create a wiki page for that table and clean it up where it appears presentable and easy to read Just let me know if you want me to and I'll get right on it.

Arturo: Why would we be identified as either Nazgul or Viper pilots? The main reason for us to do so would be if we had a great many more people, as the Army does, because it would eliminate confusion as to which squad(ron) you are in. Since we only have two squadrons, either you are in one or the other and people typically know which one you are in, hence the lack of specific titles such as that.

Will: I agree wholeheartedly. In the past, it has normally been just me and one or two other people, usually Ibram and a random Navy person who just happened to be on at the time of the meeting. Even then, sometimes neither Ibram nor I can make it to the meeting and so, the Naval report is not heard. Den is rarely on IRC due a busy RL so he can never do it. I actually feel that its kind of depressing that we have to get paid to come to the meetings.
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Willtconq
ComNet Sage
 
Willtconq
 
[VE-NAVY] 2nd Lieutenant
 
Post Number:  3704
Total Posts:  4599
Joined:  Oct 2004
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 4:43:03 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
I don't pay people to come to meetings, i simply rewarded them for coming not knowing they'll get paid. :P
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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Hunter-Morrell
ComNet Veteran
 
Hunter-Morrell
 
[VE-NAVY] Master Chief Petty Officer
[VE-VEEC] Word Slinger
 
Post Number:  1185
Total Posts:  2071
Joined:  Jun 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 4:45:31 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
I was actually talking about the meeting attendance topics. In the past, we were paid 100,000 ICs for attending the meeting. Now its like 10,000 ICs, but meh. I was just saying, if we have to be bribed to come to meetings, doesn't that make us look bad? Just a thought.
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Arturo
ComNet Novice
Imperial Baronet

 
Arturo
 
[VE-NAVY] Senior Crewman
 
Post Number:  36
Total Posts:  277
Joined:  Oct 2009
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 5:21:29 PM    View the profile of Arturo 
Hunter, I don't literally mean for us to have a Squadron ID next to our rank and callsign on the ComNet, but for each equadron to have its own identity and... spirit, if you will. 

Will, I'm not saying Nazgul or Viper doesn't have pride, but morale goes beyond pride.  As I said, its about a squadron's own identity; not the name, but who they are and what are they known for.  Savvy?
SCRW Arturo Lee
Nazgul Squadron Flight 3 Member
Imperial Baronet
FM/SCRW Arturo Lee/Nazgul 3-11/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1FLT/VEN/VE/(=*A*=)
Shazam
ComNet Sage
 
Shazam
 
[VE-NAVY] Commodore
[VE-VEEC] Journalist
 
Post Number:  3650
Total Posts:  4197
Joined:  Jun 2003
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 5:36:36 PM    View the profile of Shazam 
*Nods* The role of IRC has been one on my mind for sometime as well, and from what I've experienced in the past, IRC is actually pretty vital in a couple of ways, but maybe not in the order you would think. The most important aspect of it, to me, for instance, aren't the meetings: they're the interactions taking place in squadron channels. But, how often do we see people in #Nazgul and #Viper? And how many people at a time? If you want some insight as to why many folks don't stick to the Navy, you have to take a close look at our lack of real-time interpersonal relations. If you expect that people are going to get excited about our division on our writing merits alone, you're sorely mistaken, lol. People need real-time interaction: IRC is a place to get beyond the surface concerns of activity and make actual connections: find commonalities, share differences of opinion, and laugh at the same ridiculous behavior. I'm not saying you folks don't do that: obviously you do, but for those members who came and then went: I bet they didn't. Sporadic appearances and conversations aren't enough folks: you have to show them that they're apart of a team, and that means getting together as a squadron. Competitive is not necessarily disrespectful either, btw; in fact, when competition increases and people have to fight harder to be on top, relationships in squadrons become deeper and the rewards and praise, when captured, are more meaningful.

As for the meetings: why are the meetings so important? Well, they're the seminal point of the week where the contributions of both divisions are allowed to be showcased and, in particular, where individuals receive praise. You'll note that the Army, though I don't wish to make too many comparisons between the Army and Navy (they're really two very different animals), is much more consistent about medaling and promotions, and they're attendance is usually quite a bit higher than ours. Why? Well, folks in the army know that they could receive a promotion or medal at any time, and that if they're not there to receive it, they won't get to share that moment with their peers. What I'm sayin is that, from my place of viewing anyway, if you wanna fix meeting attendance, in addition to creating a closer, more competition driven squadron, you have to fix the way we promote and medal people. Atrasin offered up the idea of adding more ranks to make promotions easier to give away, but we have to remember that that's been tried before. Furthermore, every time you add more medals or ranks to the system, they actually lose value and become more a show of the Navy's willingness to compensate you and less a show of our gratitude and respect. While our stories are fictional, our medals and promotions do have a place in reality, and we need to remember that.

I'd also note that before the closing of several squadrons in the early 2000s, Naval meeting attendance was quite high and promotions were given out more often. So, as you might be seeing, there's a kind of continuum: if you can ease off the fear of promoting too early, or from reacting and inflating the rewards system, you can actually increase the rate at which you recognize and promote members because more people are sticking around. Kind of a big loop of things, but they're certainly connected.

On a final note, the significance of receiving that reward or promotion is also influenced by who is giving it. The object in question receives significantly more value to the person receiving it when that person is receiving it from someone very high in the chain of command. So- the rewards that are only given by the high command, and not simply the SC (a member you may be in contact with every day), become 'distinguished' or signs of an 'elite' member. So- higher-ups have to show up to meetings as well.
*Flash Was Here...*

FM/COM Shazam/Nazgul 3-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN (=A=) (=*SA*=) (=MA=) (=*FOCE*=) [CBV*] [LoM] [LSM] [MC2] [VC:S] [SV*] [DSM] [KC] {Platinum Writing Medal}
[This message has been edited by Shazam (edited November 5, 2009 5:55:59 PM)]
Drac
ComNet Member
 
Drac
 
[VE-NAVY] Chief Petty Officer
 
Post Number:  401
Total Posts:  2189
Joined:  Jan 2009
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 5:37:47 PM    View the profile of Drac 
Please kill double post.

-Drac
FL/CPO Drac/Nazgul 3-9/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Imperial Fleet/VEN/VE
(=*A*=)(=*SA*=) [SoA][MC:2][MC:1][NSR:H][NT:H]

He is no fool who gives up what he cannot keep in order to gain what he cannot lose.
Drac's VE Wiki Profile: http://www.vastempire.com/wiki/index.php?title=Drac
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[This message has been edited by Drac (edited November 5, 2009 5:39:01 PM)]
Drac
ComNet Member
 
Drac
 
[VE-NAVY] Chief Petty Officer
 
Post Number:  402
Total Posts:  2189
Joined:  Jan 2009
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 5:38:35 PM    View the profile of Drac 
You just haven't been here long enough, Arturo. For example, the green stuff is one of the things that makes up Nazgul's "identity". Of all the identifiers, it is by far the easiest to see. The differences just aren't obvious most of the time- it takes some time to catch on to them.

I can probably stand to increase my IRC activity. Haven't been on there in months. For that matter, if I'm being honest, I can probably attend the meetings each Sunday.

-Drac
FL/CPO Drac/Nazgul 3-9/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Imperial Fleet/VEN/VE
(=*A*=)(=*SA*=) [SoA][MC:2][MC:1][NSR:H][NT:H]

He is no fool who gives up what he cannot keep in order to gain what he cannot lose.
Drac's VE Wiki Profile: http://www.vastempire.com/wiki/index.php?title=Drac
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Shazam
ComNet Sage
 
Shazam
 
[VE-NAVY] Commodore
[VE-VEEC] Journalist
 
Post Number:  3651
Total Posts:  4197
Joined:  Jun 2003
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 5:43:20 PM    View the profile of Shazam 
Again- let me just say that the meetings aren't supposed to be a chore (I used to say to my squadron members all the time if this felt like a chore, there's something wrong).  Neither, btw, are your reports: both are an opportunity to showcase your and your piers' contribution to the Navy, and the VE for that matter, at large.  Then, if you've earned it, you can receive recognition for your work.  *Cough*
*Flash Was Here...*

FM/COM Shazam/Nazgul 3-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN (=A=) (=*SA*=) (=MA=) (=*FOCE*=) [CBV*] [LoM] [LSM] [MC2] [VC:S] [SV*] [DSM] [KC] {Platinum Writing Medal}
[This message has been edited by Shazam (edited November 5, 2009 5:44:52 PM)]
[This message has been edited by Shazam (edited November 5, 2009 5:45:55 PM)]
Gunnay
ComNet Cadet
 
Gunnay
 
[VE-NAVY] Senior Crewman
 
Post Number:  259
Total Posts:  315
Joined:  Mar 2006
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 6:09:37 PM    View the profile of Gunnay 
Couple ideas for you all:

1) IRC is great! Hopping onto BS with the guys is always fun, you can even start a channel for you squadron (where you can probably get away with a lot more than in the main VE channel)

2) Meetings: Represent you squadron! People used to always put on their uniform (SCRW-Gunny, for example). Show up to meetings with your uniform on and maybe add |Kaph or |Viper or whatever to the back of your name.

3) Get competitive! Having competition between the squadrons always help activity. It rarely gets hostile, and its nice BEING ON IRC and giving a member of another squadron heck for losing the last squadron competition

4) Dont overextend yourself on the writing. Instead of trying to write 3 stories a week at 1,000 words each, maybe write 3 stories a week at 300-500 words. Youll have more to write about and give other people the chance to write.

5) Play games outside of the VE. I hear Lounge Nights are back, but if youre bored and just hanging out on IRC, why not get a game of Yahoo! Pool going, maybe place some 5k bets here and there. I would advise to keep the chatting in IRC tho, so when more people come on they see that there are people around and they can be included.

6) INCLUDE EVERYONE!!! Like I said above, if youre on IRC or just messing around at home, hop on IRC, play games, shoot the poo (self-censor woot). The more active people see you being the more theyll want to be around.

7) Start your own competitions! Are there 4 people on IRC? Maybe 2 Navy and 2 Army or 2 Nazgul and 2 Kaph? Get a little competition going and post it in your squadron topic. Get those bragging right and give others the chance to steal 'em back from ya.


Just some ideas for yall, good luck!
Senior Crewman Gunnay
Nazgul 3-2
Adjutant to the Training Officer
A:TO/FM/SCRW Gunnay/Nazgul 3-2/Wing I/mSSD Atrus/1VIF/VEN/VE (=*A*=)
Hunter-Morrell
ComNet Veteran
 
Hunter-Morrell
 
[VE-NAVY] Master Chief Petty Officer
[VE-VEEC] Word Slinger
 
Post Number:  1186
Total Posts:  2071
Joined:  Jun 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 6:14:09 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
And you are?
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Gunnay
ComNet Cadet
 
Gunnay
 
[VE-NAVY] Senior Crewman
 
Post Number:  262
Total Posts:  315
Joined:  Mar 2006
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 6:36:38 PM    View the profile of Gunnay 
Potentially a returning member if they want to stick me somewhere.

I would like to edit my #4:

Squadron Leaders may find it in their best interest to put a word limit on the stories. If someone only has to write 300-700 words, then another person only has to read 300-700 words. For those with time constraints, it can be hard to keep up with multiple 1000+ word posts. Just an idea, take it how ya will
Senior Crewman Gunnay
Nazgul 3-2
Adjutant to the Training Officer
A:TO/FM/SCRW Gunnay/Nazgul 3-2/Wing I/mSSD Atrus/1VIF/VEN/VE (=*A*=)
Willtconq
ComNet Sage
 
Willtconq
 
[VE-NAVY] 2nd Lieutenant
 
Post Number:  3707
Total Posts:  4599
Joined:  Oct 2004
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 6:49:43 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
i actually agree. sometimes, it gets scary coming back and see a wall of text that needs to be read. much easier to read more posts that are much shorter. and as mentioned, it gives other people to post in between.

for example, my recent 5000+ word post. i dare someone from nazgul to say they didn't have a single thought of "damn, i have to read all that." I even thought of it when i went back to proof read my own post before posting.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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Hunter-Morrell
ComNet Veteran
 
Hunter-Morrell
 
[VE-NAVY] Master Chief Petty Officer
[VE-VEEC] Word Slinger
 
Post Number:  1187
Total Posts:  2071
Joined:  Jun 2008
Status:  Offline
  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 8:20:27 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
I have taken your dare I actually didn't think that at all. I read the whole thing without skipping anything. I just thought, "Oh. Hey. Thats a long post, but its just a little more to read, nothing more."
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Atrasin
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 8:54:37 PM    View the profile of Atrasin 
a couple of points:

1) the extra ranks were set up for a multi-tiered career mode that Ibram and i had kicked around...might be something to look at again.

2) this is a game, no one wants to be a CPO for 2 years, or a LCRW for 6 mos. we've got to keep them intersted and coming back.  plus, if we have more people, we'll need the officers and high ranked non-coms to staff'em.

3) i'll be damned if i'm gonna put a limit on a good story. i've worked too hard over the last year+ to get people to expound on their characters and give detail.  sorry, but that's how i feel.

4) we might want to look at bringing back the Task Force as a career option. writing capital ship stories are different from fighter stories. just cuz it didn't work once before, doesn't mean it won't work this time.
SC|ESN Geordi "Driver" Atrasin/Nazgul 1-1/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN/VE/[=A=][=^SA^=][=^ME^=][=*MA*=][=FOCE=][MC1]{BWC}[NSR:1]{SAS}{SWC}
Vacuus Ordo, Nex  -Without Order, Death
All a man can betray is his conscience. - Joseph Conrad
We few, we happy few. We band of brothers. - Henry V
May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - General George S. Patton Jr.
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Hunter-Morrell
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:05:10 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
Task Force? I believe that would be something good to at least try. A few people could try it out and if it works, expand from there.
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Denethor
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:07:31 PM    View the profile of Denethor 
I agree with Will and Shaz on all of their points

Especially the ones I'm going to talk about now.

First is IRC. When I first joined in 01, IRC was where everyone was. People actually were rarely on the ComNet. I actually felt it necessary to port into ThreeOf4's home computer so I could log into IRC because my parents' internet provider didn't allow access to IRC. There were days that easily half of the VE was logged on and actually involved in conversation. I think the biggest issue now is that a lot of the time new folks think that you have to pay for IRC, and it's hard to tell them (publicly) that you don't actually have to pay for it. So maybe sending them something in their welcome message letting them know that they don't have to pay for its use, we'd get more people on. As for the meetings, I do think that these are a vital part of the life of the VE, and I do apologize for pretty much never being there. As Hunter said, I do have a busy RL life, and some of that is because I work in theatre and we have matinees that run through the meeting time. But the other part is that weekends are free time the rest of the time, and I unfortunately choose social life over the VE, and I wholeheartedly apologize for that. You folks deserve a leader that is actually present, and I promise that I will change that.

Secondly is the promotions. Until Will and Shaz returned, we had 2 officers outside of the NHC, and not many folks over the position of Petty Officer. And the XO of the Navy is a Captain (now I'm not saying that I deserve a promotion at this time, because honestly, I don't) But, that's a bit ridiculous in my opinion. People should be rewarded, and when they reach a certain point that requires a test or anything be taken to achieve that rank, than it should be given to them right away. Most of you all deserve at least two more ranks than you currently hold, and I will work on getting that rectified. It would be a bit ridiculous for people to have 5 or more of the same medal because "we're afraid of promoting too much". Look at the Army, at least a third of every squad has people with ranks over that of Sergeant, which is equivalent to Chief Petty Officer or higher, and we have 4 people total (not including SCs or returning Officers) that exceed that rank. So as I said I will be rectifying that in the near future. And don't take this to offense to whichever NTO made this change, but I was actually just talking to one of the CPO's that wishes to take his MAE, and I remember in my day the MAE was just like any other AE, you could take the test, send it in, and get it graded. Now it's like the FOCE was when I took it, over IRC, and the FOCE is like a journey in the DJO. I'm not sure that this is the path we want to continue down. I think we want to make the test that are for non-comm positions easier to access, and the officer grade test the more personable one. Perhaps for a position over that of Commodore we can consider something like the FOCE is now.


And for Driver, the Task Force was a fantastic idea, however it was implemented incorrectly. We had a bunch of returning people, and a FL that was not entirely dependent, working on that project. And for a while, I was the only person posting on it. Will, Art, and DH helped out a couple of times, but it was pretty much a failure because we had too many people involved that had been set in their old goat ways. I think with a fresh batch of folks, it could really take off.
Kam "Denethor" Vox
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Vast Empire Navy
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"Only the dead have seen the end of war." -Plato
Every drop of blood. Every bitter tear. Every bead of sweat. I live for this.
Hunter-Morrell
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:13:52 PM    View the profile of Hunter-Morrell 
I guess I'll volunteer for the Task Force if it starts up and everything. You guys know that you can count on me to be active But yeah, I do believe that all of the tests should be able to be taken in your own time and sent in whenever you're eligible.
Master Chief Petty Officer Hunter Morrell
XO/MCPO Hunter-Morrell/Nazgul 5/Wing 1/mSSD Atrus/1Flt/VEN/VE [CBV][BRC][BWC][MC:1]
Willtconq
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:28:02 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
a new tiered system would of course work better if we can get the capital ship idea off the ground. At the time it was first introduced, activity was on the decline, not a whole lot of people were interested, and there wasn't much of effort put into its development. i would definitely be willing to help with that program again, provided that enough members are interested. However, we do need to keep in mind that the squadrons will suffer a bit as a result of members being reassigned to capital ship positions.
__________

I agree entirely agree on the promotion part. Everyone loves to get promotions, there's no down side to them. if one person got one promotion every week, that's only about 2 promotions per person in a year. and we're talking every single week. in fact, i think that's a good goal to aim for, 1 promotion per week at minimum, excluding promotions for passing exams, those are bonus. :P
____________

As for the post limit, I didn't mean to not allow long posts, that's a big no-no. we want our members to develop into better writers, not limit them. However, I meant that we shouldn't look down upon people who can only write 300 posts, yet feel pressured to write more because that's what everyone else is doing. many times those who are only able to put out 300 word posts at first may feel alienated when they see the rest of their squad pumping out 1000word posts. They may become easily frustrated or feel belittled. i know I did, as well as some members under my command in the past.

So this is my solution to that problem. We have a Venom squadron. so why not get a story going for them? new members get a 2 month training period or so in Venom before being reassigned to the Big guys. I can't remember if this idea has been presented before and whether or not if it worked. but ultimately, the goal is to have lower expectations for members until they are ready to take on the task and, regardless how unintentional, the responsibility, pressure, and expectations of the bigger squads.

The story could be just a free-for-all story where new people can jump in and leave at any time. And they can leave Venom and be transferred whenever they have completed all the required tasks and feel comfortable enough to move on.

Just an idea. I realize there's much planning and man power needed. Just an idea.

_______


In regards to the tests. No offense to Shaz, I know you put a ton, ton of work into making the Naval Academy to its present position. But I do agree with Den on the fact that the tests are very tough, and in my opinion, over the top. The current MAE carries over a period of almost half a year, 3 months min, and over 4 ranks. And i haven't even had a chance to look at the FOCE yet. If we incorporate Driver's idea for a new pay structure, and take into the idea that "Real" officer-ship is indeed in the up top echelons, such as Commodore and above, then I think the system would be more reasonable. In that case, the FOCE would be a requirement for Admiralty, and MAE a requirement for Officer candidacy.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
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"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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[This message has been edited by Willtconq (edited November 5, 2009 9:42:48 PM)]
Atrasin
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Atrasin
 
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:30:49 PM    View the profile of Atrasin 
i believe that the Task Force needs to be a separate career path. too many times we are double and triple dipping...makes for overwoked folks, and something will suffer.

i propose that once you hit SC and are in position for at least 6 mos. you can take a test of some sort (preferablly leadership based) and choose to take command of a capital ship.

you'd start small and work your way up to a Star Destroyer. no TIE squadron stories or the like: you command a ship and all on board. maybe we can even set up personell to be the crew as a career path.
SC|ESN Geordi "Driver" Atrasin/Nazgul 1-1/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN/VE/[=A=][=^SA^=][=^ME^=][=*MA*=][=FOCE=][MC1]{BWC}[NSR:1]{SAS}{SWC}
Vacuus Ordo, Nex  -Without Order, Death
All a man can betray is his conscience. - Joseph Conrad
We few, we happy few. We band of brothers. - Henry V
May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't. - General George S. Patton Jr.
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Gunnay
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Gunnay
 
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:32:43 PM    View the profile of Gunnay 
@Atrasin: Is it possible to split the squadrons up so that the people who'd rather write shorter posts (maybe not enough time to read through the longer ones) into one group and those that want to write long, detailed stories are in another? I mean, honestly, I wouldve stayed in the VE this whole time if I didnt have to wade through posts up to, like will's, 5000 words. For me it's one thing to create a detailed character history, but another thing entirely to try and keep up with the long posts for squadron stories.
Senior Crewman Gunnay

FORMERLY:
Nazgul 3-2
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A:TO/FM/SCRW Gunnay/Nazgul 3-2/Wing I/mSSD Atrus/1VIF/VEN/VE (=*A*=)
Willtconq
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 9:50:37 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
Driver, I noted that the squadrons will suffer if the Task Force comes to fruition. And yes, it will be an entirely different structure from pilot corps. However, i don't think that squadron experience is required. Those with previous leadership experiences in squadrons will naturally be allowed a higher position on a ship, and a new recruit could become one of many Deck Chiefs that preps the fighters, or a technician of some sort. And they too have the chance to work their way up to a command position on the ship.

In time, the pilot corp and task force could even do stories together and make some really interesting histories.


Gunnay, I did present the Venom squadron idea in my previous post.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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Arturo
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 11:08:59 PM    View the profile of Arturo 
Will-

I was done with my training and placed in Nazgul in only a couple of days.  I was in and out of Venom Squadron in under a week, too fast for me to ever be on the roster there.  Two months?  I know that most don't go as quickly as I do through Basic, but I doubt two months is necessary unless the training program gets a serious overhaul and step-up in difficulty.

Can anyone tell me more about this "task force" idea?  PM me if you want, please.  It sounds like something I might be interested in...
SCRW Arturo Lee
Nazgul Squadron Flight 3 Member
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[This message has been edited by Arturo (edited November 5, 2009 11:10:14 PM)]
Drac
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 11:31:39 PM    View the profile of Drac 
My ideal for the Task Force, or possibly just for Task Force competitions or maybe just a related side-game, would be to allow members to use ships purchased at the ICS. Up to this point the only recourse we've had to use those ships is solo CD stories and the rare idea like the Ykntola Order or my Mon Calamari Knights story...and even those tend to be extremely awkward and unsuccessful.

Letting members use their ships in direct service to the VE would be awesome. We could also incorporate limits through set maximums of # of ships & ship size for each rank.

Otherwise we're still where we are right now in regard to those ships...I can say I've got an eight ship fleet, but it doesn't do a thing for me. Ships are just bragging rights, and hollow ones at that.

-Drac
FL/CPO Drac/Nazgul 3-9/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Imperial Fleet/VEN/VE
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He is no fool who gives up what he cannot keep in order to gain what he cannot lose.
Drac's VE Wiki Profile: http://www.vastempire.com/wiki/index.php?title=Drac
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Shazam
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 11:34:40 PM    View the profile of Shazam 
Lol- I know it's a horrible system- no need to apologize, lol.  I'm ganna try to break it down into the basics of what's going on here, but there's a bit to read, so I appologize in advance.  Since it's open to debate, I figured you might like to know why things are the way they are, as well as some alternative ideas I had.  In my defense, lol: I've known since I first created the MEs that it wasn't quite what I was looking for, but it would take me up until early 2008 to really have a thorough understanding as to why it didn't work.  Now for a breif run-through?  Lol.

First and foremost: the MEs aren't being implemented in the manner it was designed to be used.  I tried to work it the way it was initially planned, but I was completely over my head with responsibilities, so it just wasn't happenin, lol.  The MEs, ya see, was a direct reaction to the things we're still talking about, namely the difficulty in promoting members on a consistent basis.  The Mes weren't created to fix the entire situation, but I thought if we could offer tests that would legitimately enhance the performance of individuals, and promote them incrementally, we could offer a real pathway to officerhood.  However, the MEs turned into a database dependent series of tests that only tested one's reading comprehension and patience, not their metal as a leader or their true ambition as a pilot.  Thus, the MEs missed thier mark.  By the time I got to the MA, aside from being a bit exhausted, we'd invested so much time into the MEs that it would seem fruitless to not include a review of that information in the MA- so the MA became a kind of review/continuation test taken in real-time over IRC.  Don't get me wrong: they're good tests over the materials, but they do little to help the Navy, and, in their current form, are monsters, lol.

I was developing an alternative near the end of my tenure here in early 2008, though, and it went something like this.  I wanted to convert the pages of material we'd collected for the MEs/MA, those pages and pages and pages on equipment details and tactical decisions in various scenarios...  And convert them to articles.  Instead of making them a part of some test, we could collect them into a series of articles designed to inform the interested pilot, and then offer accreditation or reward for those who read through and understood them.  Therefore, we created an incentive and excitement for the materials versus a never-ending series of tests one had to complete to become an officer.  It would take a little work, and much of the materials needed re-working anyway, but it would be a great resource and would also remove a serious block in our training system.  What would replace it though?

Ask yourself this- what's the purpose of the SA?  The MA?  The FOCE?  They're supposed to test whether or not you're ready for flight, squadron or wing command, in that order, right?  Or something close to it.  But, in reality, they're nothing of the sort.  Instead, the culture in the VEN has been to use tests as a means of promotion.  You might say- well, duh- but that's an awful idea, lol.  Why?  Because you're adding an element to the equation that may or may not happen.  As an SC, you say- well, he shouldn't be promoted unless he has this exam, or the exam is ganna take care of the promotion anyways- so suddenly the very existence of the exams is jeopardizing someone's promotion.  On top of that though, when people don't get promoted, we use tests as a fall-back to promotion.  For instance, when a higher-up thinks that someone is ready to be an officer, they have them take a meaningless test so that they have an excuse to promote them.  That's what happened with myself and the MA (which was not much harder than the Aviator's, even in its initial form).  So instead of saying- "we'd like to make you an officer because you've worked so hard," it's "take this test so we can promote you."  The tests make up the gap, in other words, which just further masks the fact that there is a gap.  Maybe I'm just snowblind, but that's like figuring out that you're in love with your best friend after you move away from her, lol: a bit after the fact, right?

What's the answer?  I'm just spit-balling now, but from what I remember thinking back then, I wanted to place the role of training on the squadron- not the academy.  Instead of going to the academy to get trained (which, who thinks about going back and getting their tests taken in a timely manner? lol), it could become a part of the squadrons' role.  I mean, who's ganna know better who's ready to become an officer than the SCs and XOs?  Plus, they're the ones who can give real opportunities to those pilots: they can let them put together or lead stories to help train them, they can allow them to edit or enhance the squadron wiki or web-page: they can assign projects in general.  Maybe we could set some loose guidelines, but I think if we wanna fix all these problems with promotions and officership: we need to give the responsibility to the squadrons.  Just spit-ballin here, lol.  *Ducks out back door...*
*Flash Was Here...*

FM/COM Shazam/Nazgul 3-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1VENF/VEN (=A=) (=*SA*=) (=MA=) (=*FOCE*=) [CBV*] [LoM] [LSM] [MC2] [VC:S] [SV*] [DSM] [KC] {Platinum Writing Medal}
[This message has been edited by Shazam (edited November 5, 2009 11:54:41 PM)]
[This message has been edited by Shazam (edited November 6, 2009 2:55:27 AM)]
Willtconq
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Willtconq
 
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  RE: New List
November 5, 2009 11:39:23 PM    View the profile of Willtconq 
Actually going through the Academy in 2 days is quite often. It won't necessarily mean a step up in difficulty. but my idea was to make Venom into a stepping stone rather than just for the looks as it stands now.

For you personally, as far as i can tell, your writing seems pretty up to par with the rest of Nazgul. and you seem to be pretty comfortable there, so it wouldn't have affected you much. But Gunnay on the other hand, has expressed that he would have liked a squadron where he could improve for a big before moving on.
-(William the Conquerer)-
Ex Ship Captain of Tiamut
King of PPC 16,000 clicks and counting
"A dishonest man, you can always trust to be dishonest. Honestly, it's the honest ones you want to watch out for, because you can never predict when they're gonna do something incredibly stupid." - Captain Jack Sparrow
"Happy endings are just stories that haven't finished yet." - Jane Smith
FM/2LT Willtconq/Nazgul 2-4/Phoenix Wing/mSSD Atrus/1st Fleet/VEN/VE (=*A*=) (=*SA*=)(=^MA^=) [VC:S][SV][BWC][SWC][LSM][CBV]
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