Preface and prethoughts:I don't know wether to post this on the Main, Lounge, or Army comnets. But a lot of what is said can be used by everyone, so I decided to post it here. If there are any gramatical errors, please excuse them. I have also looked into the coment V1 archives to look at some imformation. I have written this message to state what I believe to be some porblems in the VE army. (I don't know anything about what is going on the Navy side so I don't know if this would apply there.) Some of you might think that what I am about to state is offensive or that it is a load of rubish. If you all feel that way then ask Kadann or someone else with power to delete this message, but I believe is needs to be said. I am writing this from three diferent points of view. As and SL, a trooper who needs to get his thought out of his head, and as a new recruit. There are several points below with a conclusion. You will porbably not agree with most of them, but I hope that this will help the VE get out of this bumpy area in its life and get back to what I believe to be the real reason it was created.

1. I believe the VE's original purpose was to let people who enjoyed star wars meet, write, and play games. If it wasn't than I think that is what it has turned into today. It should a be a place where people can write about their favorite science fiction (Star Wars). New recruits should be able to join without being asked to take sides of an arguement. They should be able to just join, write, and have fun. But they can't. For half of the time I have been in the VE, I have seen fueds, bickering, backstabbing, swearing, arguing, gossip, subversion, coersion, political and non-political disputes, fights, dissention, downsizement, discouragement, disertion (I did that one, not to proud of it but atleast I admit it), and vehement messages. I have one question for all of you. WHY? The VE should be a place where you can write and have fun. Unless you see anyone of the above things as fun, why would you do them. I am not saying to not discuss things or show your points of view, but there is a fine-line between arguing and discussing. A lot of them time we don't see it and just step right over that line. If you want to have political power struggles or spark fights, than I ask you to leave the VE and make your own website to do it. There is no need for it. A lot of these fights are held because of a previous fight. One of the people was then punished and then argues about it.  They get demoted and stripped of postition and then they argue about that. Why bother? Why do we need to be in higher postitions. All you get is more work and fake money. If you want the higher postition so you can have a say in things and plan stuff, than you don't understand a very important thing. You can still say your point or mention something that you think would be fun without being in a place of predominant power. It might not always be done, but atleast you can still ask for it. If it is a good idea than it will probably be done. You don't have to yell at someone and curse at them, because they didn't like your idea or did something you didn't like. If what you say is not able to be said in the open than is need not be said at all. If you speak with reason and peace than you will likely be heard more readily. But if you go in guns blazing and you have done so in the past, you have turned yourself into the bad guy. None of this is pointing to anyone in porticular. We are all responsible for our actions and we have all done something likes that to a degree. So to conclude this point. The VE is a place for fun, and doesn't have any room for fighting, bickering, etc. (See list above). If your sole reason for being in the VE is to just cause strife and problems, I beg you to leave. There is no need for it.


2. I started this thought above, but I am now going into more detail. People will always have differences. Wether it be of oppinion or something else. But the way we handle it is what gets us into trouble. If you don't like what someone is planning to do, then just tell them in an e-mail or on IRC your point of view, and your reasons why. There is no reason to get combative either. You should be able to talk to someone (Even your worst enemy who hate and loathe) politely. Courtise is not just a formality. Since we can't see eachother words are like our actions. If you talk badly on here those words are counted for your actions. When I say being polite I don't mean pouring tea and asking if they had a good day. No, I mean not cussing, donwsizing, or anything else from the above list. If all you can say is cuss words and not your actual feelings, that just shows that you are not in the right frame of mind and don't have a good enough grasp on maturity to speak with refinement. So when you want your point heard, you should be able put whatever you say in private on an open channel. If you can't, than wait till you have calmed down and continue stating yoru point.


3. If your only reason for being in the VE is to get power and assume a higher rank, than I believe you are in the wrong place. Like I said in point 1, this is a place for fun. If you want to wage political war, than make your own site and go somewhere else. This is not to sya that you shouldn't want to gain rank. But if you are fighting all the time you ar going about it the wrong way. The true way to gain rank and position is to work hard, play, and write. Not bicker, backstab, you know the list. I ask you this. What do you get from a higher rank though? More money? More power? If that is what your after, than I don't understand you at all. It is fake money and fake power. If you want to hurt REAL peoples fealings and call them names behind their back for a bunch of FAKE stuff, than I think you need to look at your values again. If you are unable to give up yoru rank and position without a giant ordeal and fued, than you are not fit for that position. The real point here is to write, game, and have fun. THose things should go above your position and rank. If I was reduced to PFC right now for writing this message, than I have two things to say. One, this is my point of view and if you do hurt me for writing this than there is no freedom of speech. And two, fine. I don't care if I am demoted to Gungan. I am not here for power or fake money. I am here to have fun.


4. Activity. I know a lot of you don't like it when you are asked to write. But if you say you are active and not on leave than it is expected of you. If you are unable to post on a story once every two weeks, than you should say that you have to go on semi-leave. If you are on semi-leave for three months in the busiest time of year, I don't have a problem. But if you say you can write and don't, you are holding other more active members up. If you are expecting to not be able to write for a series of months, I believe you should ask to be put into reserves for that time and then be placed back into active duty as soon as that time is over and you can write again. If you hate writing, I completly understand. I used to also. But you should be able to scrounge out a paragraph as long as point 3. in this message. That is all that is expected of you per week if you are really busy. If you post that small ever time it isn't exceptible. But if you don't have the time to write a long message and you are holding everyone else up, than it is fine if you do a short bit like that.


5. I am digging my own grave by writing this, but it has to be said. To senior officers: you all have the power to punish, demote, ban, etc. to anyone below you. But don't let that power go to your head. I have said above that people should be able to put their points in front of you. If they do it porperly and peacefully than you should hear them out. But if you don't and just yell at them for stating there point (BY saying they are questioning orders) than I would have to leae the VE for good. Stating their point of veiw and questioning orders are two different things. If they say it in a bad manner and curse at you, then that is questioning orders. BUt if they are polite than you have to listen and consider what they have to say. Even if you hate their guts. To all the troopers that aren't above me: This doesn't mean that you have free reing to ask what you get in return if you do something or  badger them about your point over and over again. Once you have made yoru statement peacibly you have no other say in the matter. If you carry on being insubordinate than you will probably be punished. So in the end. Troopers respect your commanders decisions but if you feel like they arent right than say why nicely. Senior officers, if they do come to you or you ned something, than listen to them and try not to dismiss them emediatly. And if you need something from them than you should also be courtious. Lead by example. I am so daed for writing point 5. but it is true.


Conclusion: In the end I am asking us all to shape up and be nicer. There is no need for all the constant strife that is happening. It is hard to go one week without someone causing a large incident on IRC or the coment, that shouldn't have happened at all. I have heard that some of you think I am a suck up (I don't want to repeat the actual term used) that has no backbone. But if I was either of those I wouldn't have written this. Some of the things in here apply to people in authority. So I would like it if you didn't say those things behind my back again. I would much prefer it in front. Atleast then you can say you have a backbone, for only cowards say things about other people when they aren't around. If anyone would like to put donw there points of view below this post than go ahead. I don't want to see any slander or things like that. If you have a proper, dignified responce than put it here. Otherwise don't post it. Thankyou for your time. I know a lot of people will no like this post, but I thought it needed to be put out there. And you won't believe the weight that has been taken off of my shoulders. This is way to long for me to read through again, so if there are any more mistakes I appologize. If there are any really bad spots with bad grammar, try to read through them and I appologize a second time. I tried to write this as neatly and fluidly as I could. I thank you again for your time. Good day.
 
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Senior Sergeant Kairo
Squad Leader
*DarkDragoons*

SL/SR.SGT Kairo/2SQD/1PLT/1COMP/1BAT/1RGT/VEA/VE [CDS][BoA][CoR]

"Others will only believe in you, if you believe in yourself first." -- Kairo

I agree with you on all points Kairo, but I am curious as to how you have seen those in authority abusing their powers?

I also think you have a very good idea about what the VE is. We ARE here to have fun and write about one of the greatest science fiction works of all time. However, this is also a role playing organization. We imitate and strive to be just a like the Empire, a militaristic society ruled by a dictator. Therefore, people need to learn how to play the role they are in. A trooper openly challenging a superior's orders is grounds for a court-martial and explusion in any military, so why should it be tolerated here? Orders are given and they need to be followed. If this doesn't happen, then what you wind up with is a break down of the basic chain of command, or in short, a big ass mess.

This is not to say that we cannot voice our opinions, but there is a fine line that has been crossed by the recent guilty parties. Even in real militaries there are channels and places where you can onject to the way things are done, but publicly disobeying and talking down to a superior? Plotting against your Squad Leader? Trying to coerce other members into joining your little uprising? To me these are flat out unacceptable.

I myself need to give props to the ENTIRE command staff for their patience and lenience thus far.

Looking back on what I myself took part in a few months ago, I KNOW I got off easy. If I had been in Fury's position there would have been no hesitation in k-lining the people involved. By realizing that I was given a second chance in the VE, I was able to move forward from this and use it as motivation to mature myself.

AS far as Fury's post, I think you did the right thing, and continue to do the right thing for these cirumstances. You gave these people several chances to redeem themselves and they pissed them away. Should you be harder or people in future occurances? In my opinion yes, but I'm a hard ass on things like that. Your question of you not being approachable is totally false, as I've never had an issue with bringing suggestions or ideas to you.

In summary,the fine line between voicing your opinion, and making an ass out of yourself trying to get your way is a difficult one to tread. No one likes to be told "No, you're wrong", "Or no, thats not the way thigns get done around here." But the mature response is to accept that and move on. Throwing a fit and trying to displace the people who make this club run, and who the VE would surely crumble without, is  just *expletive deleted* stupid.

Grow up.
 
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Demolitions - Iron Horse Squad
TRP/SGT Jikkyo "Angel" Nimiichi/1SQD/1PLT/1COMP/1RGT/1BAT/VEA/VE/Tadath [LoR] [RoM] [BC] [CDS] {BoA}
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Sith Knight
CM/DJK Jikkyo "Angel" Nimiichi/Eagle 1-1/Sith/VEDJ/VE/Lopen [VP:1]
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Fallen....only to rise.
Risen...only to fall.
The circle is now complete.
The Angel of Death has returned.

I think this whole thing is the result of the minority ruining the fun of the majority. Selfish motivation has caused such an uncomfortable circumstance as of late that I wouldn't be surprised if its scaring people away, especially new recruits. They come here to have fun, and are thrown into a mass of confusion resulting from power plays between a few select individuals.

When I came to VE it was a relatively close knit community. As of late, the 'fun factor' of the entire operation has become bogged down in this political fueding.

Like Kairo said, we are here to have FUN

Maybe its time people stopped thinking about themselves and started thinking about the good of VE as a whole. Those who were given a second chance only to act up again have lost a great deal of respect in my eyes. Indeed, a few of the individuals who were once role models of a sort for me are now seemingly throwing the values they used to idealize, like respect, in the dirt.

Please stop, or take it elsewhere, away from VE grounds

Don't ruin it for the rest of us.
 
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Iron Horse Squad
ASL/SGT Kami/1SQD/1PLT/1COM/1BAT/1RGT/VEA/VE [LoR] [CoR] [IG] [GCA]
TRN/JRN Kami/Training 1-3/VEDJ/VE
-=Surrender to your darkest dreams, and you'll live as you've never lived before...=-

(o^_^o)

At the risk of sounding philosophical, I do have something of a statement to make, please bare with me because I think reading the whole post will be worthwhile, it has certainly been worthwhile for me to reflect and post this, perhaps it might be a conversation point to discuss what Rizzit described as the dark ages of the VE.

There are times in a person's life where they have an epiffany and suddenly their eyes are openned to a whole new perspective that they didn't know they had or they recognize that what they have become is something that is completely unrecognizeble from what they thought themselves at one time to be.  The latter applies to the epiffany I had over the last two nights after the latest controversy I found myself in.  In the time after my discussion with Fury and Kadann, and thinking about some of Fury's points and the points people have made on here, particularly the ones made by Kami, I realized, as I had mentionned on occasion but regretful never acted upon, the person I was becoming in the army was far different from the person I once was when I started my period of my greatest level of army activity (late November 2003).

There is an old story of the black knight and the white knight.  In a great castle overseeing a dark forest, the white knights were selected for their honour, chivalry, and commitment to goodness and dignity.  They trained long and hard in the castle, preparing to make their ventures outside of the castle's walls to find the black knight below.  As each one was ready, they mounted their white horses and departed in search of their foe.

The black knight was a man of evil.  He had stolen money, killed the innocent, forced his way into the bed of an inn keeper's daugter, stolen horses, and haunted the towns and villages in the forests of the kingdom.

As so many before him, the white knight set out from the castle in search of the menace to the kingdom.  Days and weeks passed, but the white knight was unrelenting in his search to bring down his foe.  He would let nothing stand in his way, for he knew his cause righteous and pure and all that he did was justified in his hunt.  When he ran out of provisions, he ransacked a shopkeepers store and rode off with the money and provisions.  When he was poor and tired, he stayed at the inn and shared the inn keeper's daughter's bed.  When his horse died, he stole one from the stables of the inn.  When the town guard tried to stop him, he struck him down with his sword for standing in the way of his righteous cause.

Eventually, tired, broke, and hungry, the white knight stopped to rest in the forest.  His horse was thin and weak, the knight, having shed pieces of his armour was weak and tired as as well.  All of a sudden, another white knight came crashing through the forest, sword high, gleaming in the sun.  The sun radiated off of the knight's white armour giving him an almost holy appearance.  The tired knight mounted his horse and hailed the fellow white knight.  But the charging white knight only raised his sword higher, preparing to strike down the tired knight.  The tired knight paniced and raced off into the forest, the white knight on his tail.  The tired knight's horse, however, was too weak and soon the horse collapsed and died.  The white knight arrived shortly after and dismounted from his horse.  He approached the tired knight who was lying against a tree, and raised his sword.  The tired knight begged him to stop, saying he was one of them.  But as he did, he looked down at himself and realized his white clothing had become black.  Upon this realization, he recognized, he had become the black knight.


If you read the story I just posted, I think you might gather what I am about to say next.  Over the past two days I've recognized that in the past year, I too have become the black knight.  What I have become in VE is the exact opposite of what I desired to be.  It took a long time to recognize and has come far too late, but after examining things I have said in the past and what I have done, I have recognized, rather painfully, that I have followed a path contrary to the vision I set out for myself, and contrary to who I am in reality.  The person I discovered I have been in VE shocked me, going through the logs, almost a sense of disbelief of the power politics games I have played, something I chastised the VE for having at its upper levels.

I completely agree with what people said above me.  VE once was a very fun place for me, I loved coming online each day and talking to the great people of this organization.  It was a pleasure to be active and to encourage others to be involved and active.  It was a time of activity, unity (not perfect but no organization is), and fun.  However, VE is no longer that place, it has become something else, much of it due to the changes within myself and how that has proundly impacted this organization.

I will admit, I did set out to try and change parts of VE, I truly did think my ideas would change VE for the better.  Through all of that however, I realize I engaged in activities that I criticizied much of VE for being involved in.  In essence, I changed into the black knight and became a person online who was angry, confrontational, arrogant, argumentative, self-righteous, power-hungry, and profane.  I find these changes startling with in me, especially at a personal level when I recognize that this is almost a complete polar opposite from the man I am in reality.

With that change came a direct impact on VE.  I realize, as Kami accurately stated, I have pissed away much of the respect others had for me.  I have completely errorded the trust my commanders had in me that, blinded by my own arrogance, I failed to recognize.  I have erroded much in the VE organization as a whole, something that will take time to heal and a lot of work.

In the end, I am not asking for your forgiveness for I have not earned it.  Nor am I asking for you to respect me as you once did for my actions have certainly not lived up to the expectations that come with respect or trust, nor have they lived up to my own expectations as a human being.

What I will ask for, is for you to accept the following statement at face value.  While it means little in the face of all I have done, I am truly sorry for my actions, for competely disregarding your respect and trust, and for abusing your confidence with in me.  I apologize to all of VE for my unacceptable conduct and the serious and negative ramifications they have had for the collective psyche and level of fun and activity that VE once had.  I realize that words mean little in the face of all of this, but as this is the end of my career in the army, I simply ask that you take those words at face value as they are from the lips of someone who has final realized they have become the black knight.

In my short but remaining time in VE, I will strive to shed the black shroud that has cast a dark shadow over VE and I will work hard to win your trust and respect again, though I fully recognize that such a short period of time is not enough to do so and that my actions will never earn me the level of respect and trust you once had in me.

Again I deeply apologize for my conduct, its severe impact on VE, and for letting those who trusted and respected me down.  For out of all of those, letting down those who trust and respect you is something that is bitterly painful for those who feel it, and bitterly painful to those who recognize in hindsight what they have done.


In sincere apology,

Afyon
 
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*DarkDragoons*

ASL/SSG_Afyon/2SQD/2PLT/1COM/1BAT/1RGT/VEA/VE/[LoR][IH][CoH(2)][SoA]

"The way of war is a way of deception. When able, feign inability; when deploying troops, appear not to be. When near, appear far; when far, appear near. Lure with bait; strike with chaos. If the enemy is full, be prepared. If strong, avoid him. If he is angry, disconcert him. If he is weak, stir him to pride. If he is relaxed, harry him; if his men are harmonious, split them. Attack where he is unprepared; appear where you are unexpected. This is victory in warfare; it cannot be divulged in advance. Victory belongs to the side that scores most in the temple calculations before battle. Most spells victory; least spells defeat; none, surer defeat. I see it in this way, and the outcome is apparent." -- Sun Tzu